Jake Mace
The Woodlouse, also known as John Butler, is the writer-performer-puppeteer of Do Zombies Dream of Undead Sheep?, an upcoming multimedia music show exploring humanity, consciousness, and zombies at EdFringe. We caught up with the Woodlouse for a pixelated pint (or whatever the Woodlouse equivalent of bibation is!) to find out what inspired this intriguing show.
Catch Do Zombies Dream of Undead Sheep? at Playground 1 at ZOO Playground from August 1st to 24th (not the 12th or 19th) at 21:30 (60mins). Tickets are available through the EdFringe Box Office.
Jake: Hi John! Your show Do Zombies Dream of Undead Sheep? has a philosophically-hefty and most intriguing title, tell us about what inspired it and what the audience can expect from the show.
Woodlouse: The title came very late in the writing process, when I needed a name for the show that would indicate some of its questioning nature rather than just zombie chaos (though there is definitely that happening too).
The title is a reference to Philip K. Dick’s Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? I have to admit I haven’t read the book (I probably should!), but a key theme of it is the potential humanity and consciousness of androids. My show questions whether zombies are just mindless monsters or whether they can think, feel, or even love, and whether their need to eat brains is driven by the need to survive just as much as the actions of the living are. The living make some questionable moral decisions in that drive to survive; are they really better than the zombies?
So while the zombies are absolutely not a direct allegory for anyone or anything (they are zombies, and the narrative is driven by the logic of that), in my mind the responses to them from the living explore ideas of the ‘othering’ of groups of people – and how that dangerous othering enables people to dismiss the humanity of specific groups in order to remove their rights or abuse them.
That said, I wanted to make a show that is entertaining and fun (as well as thought provoking)! I describe it as ridiculous, dark, sometimes gruesome, warm, funny and sad, and I think it is all of those things. It’s a melodramatic romp, there’re dual love stories, there’s a dance number between me and Georgie (my puppet co-star), and there’s a small amount of audience participation (they get to shout at me in unison, and to sing along at the end – it seems I derive great pleasure from making audiences sing ridiculous and somewhat dark things).
Jake: Tell us about the process of developing the show – how did you find creating a puppet/musical show and what did you learn along the way?
Woodlouse: I learnt a lot! Not least of which was that I am capable of pulling together a whole show that audiences respond well to. I really didn’t know whether I would be able to at the start. I used to perform as a teenager, both acting and music, but then for various reasons that took a back seat for around 20 years while life went in different directions, though I still played music at home and wrote songs. I was drawn back to performance via a regular local storytelling night for grownups, which I ended up telling stories at (a mix of my own and traditional stories) and ultimately became co-organiser. One month my co-organiser was disappointed that I wasn’t writing a cheerful ukulele zombie song to accompany a story that ended with an animated corpse, so I went away and wrote one. I thought it sounded like it belonged in a musical and decided to try and write the musical for it to go in.
I wrote a couple of ‘test’ songs to see whether it could work. I played one to a friend and they said “see that’s nice, but it conjures up some horrible images” which I took as a sign that I was on the right track.
The themes and plot initially emerged song by song. Once I had that skeleton of the thing, I could see where there were holes that needed filling, and equally where there were bits that did nothing to serve the story. I’ve found I can be ruthless with my own creations and am happy to cut whole chunks where necessary. I got a couple of creative friends to listen to the recorded version of the songs at one point, and they gave some excellent and equally ruthless advice, which led to more rewrites, more culling of fluff, and a much stronger narrative.
For Edinburgh I’ve had to edit even more to get the show down to just under an hour. I actually really enjoy that process; anything indulgent is removed and you’re left with the essential elements of the show.
Technically, I learned a lot about recording and mixing while composing the songs and arranging the backing tracks. I re-recorded all of them multiple times until I was happy with them (to the point that an album version of the songs from the show has just been released for streaming, and to download from Bandcamp). I also learned a huge amount about using software to animate my drawings to create the projected backdrops. I’m in awe of stop-motion animators, as what I did was many times simpler but it still took a disproportionately long time to create each few seconds of film.
Quite early on I had the idea that my co-star would be a cardboard cutout puppet, attached to a medical drip stand for structure and ease of movement across the stage, designed to look like the drawn version of themself. I have no experience of making or performing with puppets so was probably most daunted by this crucial element. I put it off until I couldn’t avoid it anymore. Thankfully my concept for the puppet worked, and I had fun learning to perform with Georgie. After the first preview show I had some mentoring from the Lyric Theatre in Bridport (my home town) which helped really bring Georgie and our interactions to life. It now feels a bit wrong every time I use the word ‘puppet’ to refer to Georgie, which I think is a good sign!
Jake: What are you hoping the audience might take away from the experience, if anything?
Woodlouse: I hope they will go away entertained and cheered, despite the darkness, but thoughtful too. If they have some of the songs stuck in their heads too, I’ll be very happy.
Possibly my favourite audience interaction was after the 2nd preview/development show (at Lighthouse, Poole). One pair initially just said “thankyou” and walked off, but then they came back and said they’d had to just go and sit down for a while to digest and process it, and had many questions, but they’d really enjoyed it.
Jake: With Edinburgh Fringe 2025 just around the corner, what are you most excited for?
Woodlouse: Getting the show seen by (hopefully!) many more people. I’m doing 22 performances of it at the Fringe, so provided I do a good job of getting people to come, I’ll have much more idea of how audiences respond to it, and will see whether a specific demographic emerges. The first preview performance (at the Lyric Theatre, in Bridport, where a final pre-Fringe preview will also be in July) was terrifying as I just couldn’t really know how it would go down. I knew that I found it really funny in places (including some of the darkest moments) and moving in others, but would anyone else? Thankfully they did! Responses from both preview performances so far have been really positive, and also helped me hone the show further. So yes, I’m excited to see how the show goes down outside of my home territory.
Also just excited for the discipline and experience of doing the show that many times. It’s bound to evolve.
And of course I really want to see what other people are doing, and will make sure I get to see plenty of other shows in between flyering and performing.
I think I’m equal parts excited and terrified about bringing my show to the Fringe! I’m autistic and will find the whirlwind of activity and people completely overwhelming at times. But at the same time there’s an energy to all that I’ll try and tap into and feed off it – in a non-zombie way – whilst also building some good napping time into my schedule.
Jake: Given the themes of Binge Fringe, if your show was a beverage of any kind (alcoholic, non-alcoholic – be as creative as you like!), what would it be and why?
Woodlouse: Obviously a Zombie cocktail springs to mind. I don’t actually know what’s in one of those though, I’ve never had one. I need to go and look! [quickly goes and does so]. So: apparently it’s a mix of dark and white rums, lime juice, orange juice (sometimes pineapple), syrups, bitters and maybe some mint leaves.
In short: it’s a mix of dark, light and nuanced flavours, contains sweetness and bitterness, but overall sounds like a very tasty and enlivening drink – I’ll definitely take that as the representative beverage for my show.
A reminder, you can catch Do Zombies Dream of Undead Sheep? at Playground 1 at ZOO Playground from August 1st to 24th (not the 12th or 19th) at 21:30 (60mins). Tickets are available through the EdFringe Box Office.
